The $20,000 Question

"PetarVN, GLI Guy, now with stupid power" (petarvn) 12/25/2013 at 21:15 • Filed to: None

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Ok guys, I'm bored and I have a question.
If you had $20,000 to buy a car, what would you go for?
Now before you say Miata (which is a valid answer) there are a few ground rules:
1. The car can't be more than 25 years old. This is a DD, and you can't spend 25 minutes getting it to start in the morning.
2. Well this is oppo, so no automatics (yes, not even Doppelkuplungs-boxes allowed!)
3. Practical: meaning you have to be able to fit a bottle of ketchup, a stick of butter, 2 sausages, a 1.25L bottle of soda, and a loaf of bread in to the trunk/frunk.

so, what would you get?

Personally, I'd get a used Golf GTi (MK5, most likely) because it ticks ALL the boxes!

Manuél Ferrari > PetarVN, GLI Guy, now with stupid power 12/25/2013 at 21:21

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Too many choices for that price!

E46 M3

E39 M5

Used Mustang or Camaro

E90 328i

used Fiesta ST

High mileage Cayman

Or as you said GTI

And that's just stuff off the top of my head

Good luck not going crazy with this decision!

TheD0k_2many toys 2little time > PetarVN, GLI Guy, now with stupid power 12/25/2013 at 21:21

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A: Two pretty nice NB Miatas

B: One NB Miata and money to tune

C: Three NA Miatas

D: One NC Miata

whoarder is tellurium > PetarVN, GLI Guy, now with stupid power 12/25/2013 at 21:22

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2004-2006 Pontiac GTO. LS1 or LS2. Manual. RWD. Aussie. With the right mods, can be greatness.

SnapUndersteer, Italian Spiderman > PetarVN, GLI Guy, now with stupid power 12/25/2013 at 21:23

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Do the sausages have to be attached to humans from birth or post-op?

Leadbull > PetarVN, GLI Guy, now with stupid power 12/25/2013 at 21:23

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E28 M5. Borderline on the age, but whatever; it's basically perfect.

scoob > TheD0k_2many toys 2little time 12/25/2013 at 21:24

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"Just" 3 NA's? I think I've seen a number of NA's go for $2,000-$4,000.

Team6.1 > PetarVN, GLI Guy, now with stupid power 12/25/2013 at 21:26

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Mid 2000s Subaru STI. Car will be previously beaten on but should be between 50-75k based on my local craigslist search. AWD, 3 pedals, a useable trunk, and the right age and price range to be hoonable without worrying too much of ruining the car. Plus I've always wanted to rally

AM3R > Manuél Ferrari 12/25/2013 at 21:28

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I pretty much agree with you.

E90 328i or E92 if you fancy a coupe

e46 M3

e39 M5

B8 A4

Higher mileage 335i (around 70k)

GTI

If you look for a while you'll find a few toyobaru's

WRX

Slightly used Mustang v6

A little different but Jeep Wrangler

A little crazy a 996

dogisbadob > PetarVN, GLI Guy, now with stupid power 12/25/2013 at 21:28

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VW usually fails #1, and the newer sporty cars fail #2 (aren't most of them automatic-only now, including the new GTI's?)

How about a CPO Fiesta ST?

Remember that the 92-96 Camry is available with a manual transmission and should be well under $20000 if not $2000!

The 2008-9 Saturn Astra is an awesome lil car, cute sporty 2- or 4-door hatch available with a HUGE panoramic sunroof, likely the smallest 4-door sold over here to have such a feature.

The 2003-2006 Matrix XRS/Pontiac Vibe GT gets you a 6-speed manual and 8200 rpm in a very useful car.

The 2007-2011 Civic Si sedan is another good choice, and so is the Acura CSX Type-S if you're in Canada, where they also got the Mercedes B-class

There's always a brand new Fiesta or Focus as well.

The Toyota Echo, Yaris, Scion xA and xB should all do the job for you. However, none of them are available with a sunroof, but they do have a LOT of space for such a small car (in fact, the Echo actually rivals the huge Camry of the same era in terms of interior space). In Canada you could even get a cute lil Echo hatchback, including a sporty RS version!

If you can find one, there is the Mazda Protege5 wagon. Very fun and practical.

The 2002-2004 Focus ZX5 should also be a good bet. There was also a wagon, but it's almost impossible to find one with a manual transmission, let alone a sunroof too.

Of course the Miata should hold the stuff you're going to carry haha

And don't forget clearance 2013 models!

TurboSloth > PetarVN, GLI Guy, now with stupid power 12/25/2013 at 21:28

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E46 M3 or an Evo 8/9.

dogisbadob > scoob 12/25/2013 at 21:28

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Well you gotta pocket for mods and autocross and shit :)

Brian Silvestro > Manuél Ferrari 12/25/2013 at 21:28

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The only thing that you didn't say that I wanted to was the E34 M5, I prefer it over the E39.

scoob > dogisbadob 12/25/2013 at 21:31

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Good point.

I saw a NA Miata with a tire rack and 4 banged up slicks once. I wonder if the driver was a Jalop?

It's a "Porch-uh" > PetarVN, GLI Guy, now with stupid power 12/25/2013 at 21:32

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I was going to say GTI as well.

One thing to beware on the MKV is the direct injection has a tendency to gum up the intake valves with carbon, which leads to mis-fires. Unless the previous owner had it cleaned out recently, budget for that, plus a water-meth injection kit. The water-meth kit will help keep it clean in the future.

scoob > TurboSloth 12/25/2013 at 21:33

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Or an STI.

*Death stare*

JKJKJK

TheD0k_2many toys 2little time > scoob 12/25/2013 at 21:33

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Well im talking ones in good DD condition. I probably should have put four

scoob > TheD0k_2many toys 2little time 12/25/2013 at 21:34

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Haha, doesn't matter. Dog is right, if you're gonna have a Miata you'll need extra change for all the goodies!

gmporschenut also a fan of hondas > PetarVN, GLI Guy, now with stupid power 12/25/2013 at 21:35

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2000ish corvette? http://www.hemmings.com/classifieds/?a…

Nibby > PetarVN, GLI Guy, now with stupid power 12/25/2013 at 21:35

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A 1995-97 Ford F250 Powerstroke 4x4.

PetarVN, GLI Guy, now with stupid power > SnapUndersteer, Italian Spiderman 12/25/2013 at 21:37

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I see what you did there!
no, I meant sausages, to make food with

DancesWithRotors - Driving Insightfully > PetarVN, GLI Guy, now with stupid power 12/25/2013 at 21:37

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Speed 3, Miata, possibly a 2013 Mazda 3 Skyactiv hatch? (The latter one is what I chose, so...)

TurboSloth > scoob 12/25/2013 at 21:39

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Mitsubishi master race reporting in. NO ROOM IN MY GARAGE FOR STI FILTH

okay, that was a bit much.

MR2_FTW - Group J's resident Stig > PetarVN, GLI Guy, now with stupid power 12/25/2013 at 21:45

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I'd buy an AW11 shell and completely restore it, then swap over my engine, suspension, and interior.

911e46z06 > PetarVN, GLI Guy, now with stupid power 12/25/2013 at 21:47

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I answered that question a couple months ago by buying an e46 M3. No regrets. If you want bigger you could get a really good e39 540 Touring and have some money left over.

Mathias Rios > PetarVN, GLI Guy, now with stupid power 12/25/2013 at 21:48

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A nice E55/E63...

911e46z06 > dogisbadob 12/25/2013 at 21:51

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Manuél Ferrari > Brian Silvestro 12/25/2013 at 22:16

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I was too lazy to do the math so I didn't know if it was over 25 years old :)

ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable) > dogisbadob 12/25/2013 at 22:16

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The Astra is not a sporty car. The roof was only available on the 5-door, which does not have the nice wheels or suspension. My wife has one, and I detest driving it.

Numb, vague, unresponsive, under-powered.

The Focus is a better all-around driver's car. Even the base models are lighte, nimble, and a blast to toss around. The 2000-20005 models can bolt-on the SVT suspension. You can even convert to rear discs if you can find all the right bits from a wrecked SVT.

The only thing the Astra has going for it is that it's pretty good on gas. But it's boring. Have more fun. Get something less efficient.

Manuél Ferrari > AM3R 12/25/2013 at 22:17

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So many options!!!!

Much variety

Such difficult decision

IDROVEAPICKUPTRUCK > PetarVN, GLI Guy, now with stupid power 12/25/2013 at 22:19

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E46 M3
WRX
E39 M5
C5 Vette
GTO
S2000
Miata
Clownshoe M Coupe
RX8

I'd take ALL of these over the GTi

Timmy - MINI With a Big Blower > PetarVN, GLI Guy, now with stupid power 12/25/2013 at 22:27

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That's... Not... How you make... WHAT. I've been lied to my entire life.

Brian Silvestro > Manuél Ferrari 12/25/2013 at 22:37

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Is it? I am equally lazy. I don't care honestly, it's my favorite car for under $20k for sure.

Manuél Ferrari > Brian Silvestro 12/25/2013 at 22:40

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No it's not over 25 years old I just meant I was too lazy to check to see if it was. I just did the math and 2014 - 25 is 1989 so E34 fits the age requirement!

What are the prices like these days? Can you get a decent one for $20K? They were made in more limited numbers than the E39 M5, no?

dogisbadob > ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable) 12/25/2013 at 22:46

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The nice wheels and suspension were indeed available on the 4-door Astra, and of course there is the aftermarket too (all the Astras are likely out-of-warranty by now anyway). Options such as Bilstein HD and Koni Yellow do exist for these cars.

140 hp is plenty on a sub-3000-lb car. Remember, fast != fun

Brian Silvestro > Manuél Ferrari 12/25/2013 at 22:47

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They most certainly were. I think less then 2000 were ever shipped to the US. I never see them on eBay but they always seem to pop up on Craigslist from time to time.

Two Examples somewhat near me:

http://newjersey.craigslist.org/cto/4212073533…

http://newjersey.craigslist.org/cto/4203556224…

The want level for that first one is off the charts, beautiful.

AM3R > Manuél Ferrari 12/25/2013 at 23:21

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$20k is a great budget for an enthusiest it'll be even better in another year or two.

Rainbow > PetarVN, GLI Guy, now with stupid power 12/25/2013 at 23:24

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AW11 MR2. The remaining money would be spent completely tearing it down and building it back up with every single piece in pristine condition. Anything leftover would go toward further weight reduction and grippier tires. That is all.

Deal Killer - Powered by Focus > PetarVN, GLI Guy, now with stupid power 12/25/2013 at 23:40

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Easy, a 2014 Mazda 3i with fog lights, all weather floor mats & remote start. With the 6-speed auto (I have to as my left knee won't take 20K miles of clutching), it comes to just $10 over the $20,000 limit. I'd be happy for years & years with this car.

Manuél Ferrari > Brian Silvestro 12/25/2013 at 23:41

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I want one too now , haha

John Norris (AngryDrifter) > whoarder is tellurium 12/25/2013 at 23:41

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GTO is the correct choice. Plenty of power, checks all the boxes.

BMW's are way too much to maintain. The price of parts are ridiculous.

Manuél Ferrari > AM3R 12/25/2013 at 23:42

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There has never been a time where you could get so much for $20K!

If older classics are in the picture then the choices are even harder.

Saracen > PetarVN, GLI Guy, now with stupid power 12/25/2013 at 23:49

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used MKVI GTI

/done

CarFanatic > PetarVN, GLI Guy, now with stupid power 12/26/2013 at 00:06

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6 year-old Audi TTS.

plak424 > PetarVN, GLI Guy, now with stupid power 12/26/2013 at 00:11

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Easy answer is easy

AM3R > Manuél Ferrari 12/26/2013 at 00:14

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Yeah, $20k can take you anywhere these days. Want a drag strip killer? Cool buy a used mustang GT. Want a canyon carver? Hey take a used 996. Want an off-roader? Grab a Jeep! Want a luxury badge? Grab a 3 series/A4/c-class with ~50k miles on it!

Manuél Ferrari > AM3R 12/26/2013 at 00:23

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You could probably even find a decent 964 in the mid 20s if you wanted a classic looking 911 with a bit more modernity than the classic

AM3R > Manuél Ferrari 12/26/2013 at 00:30

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I like how you think. If your into American muscle (I'm not THAT into it) you can pick up some nice gems too

SpeedSix > PetarVN, GLI Guy, now with stupid power 12/26/2013 at 01:03

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One decent Saab 900 Turbo Convertible and one decent Saab 900 Turbo Hatchback.

NoahthePorscheGuy > PetarVN, GLI Guy, now with stupid power 12/26/2013 at 01:52

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You could probably get a new Fiesta ST with a little bargaining. Some guys on the forums claimed to have gotten for as cheap as 19k.

NoahthePorscheGuy > Manuél Ferrari 12/26/2013 at 01:53

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I doubt anybody has dumped the Fiesta after 6 months tops. Plus with enough bargaining I bet you could get it below 20.

Manuél Ferrari > AM3R 12/26/2013 at 03:37

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Totally. There is some nice American muscle you could get for that price. And you can't lose cause values are only going up. Any cherry muscle car that had a following can only go up in value at this point

Manuél Ferrari > NoahthePorscheGuy 12/26/2013 at 03:40

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I didn't realize it was that new. Haven't followed it that closely. Pretty awesome you can get it at or maybe under $20K new with enough bargaining.

Check out the new Porsche. The old man took delivery yesterday. Hell of a steal for $6K!!

Scott Keelan > PetarVN, GLI Guy, now with stupid power 12/26/2013 at 05:23

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I'm going to join the crowd that has been suggesting new cars. I would seriously check out the new Mazda3 and Fiesta ST. Both can be purchased with a manual, will be fun to drive and most importantly will be significantly cheaper to operate than a 5-15 year old German sedan.

Goshen, formerly Darkcode > PetarVN, GLI Guy, now with stupid power 12/26/2013 at 05:37

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If you live in the US and have $20,000 to spend on a car, skip anything front-wheel-drive. Go for something serious, such as an E39 M5, LS1 Camaro or Firebird, Mustang Cobra, 6.0 GTO et al .

Klaus Schmoll > PetarVN, GLI Guy, now with stupid power 12/26/2013 at 07:32

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The GTI is a good idea. But there is a much better body for all those oily bits! I'd rather have one of these.

xx45xx > PetarVN, GLI Guy, now with stupid power 12/26/2013 at 10:19

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http://joplin.craigslist.org/cto/4245174696…

$9400

http://tulsa.craigslist.org/mcd/4231923473…

$8950

Wheel the jeep in the wind and the rain, soak up the sun on the harley. all the utility of those germans and none of the service charges!

Ladies and gentlemen, the efficiency combo.

NoahthePorscheGuy > Manuél Ferrari 12/26/2013 at 12:02

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That color *_*

Take good care of it okay?

Manuél Ferrari > NoahthePorscheGuy 12/26/2013 at 14:57

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The paint isn't finished. The prior customer stopped paying the body shop. The body shop owner sold it to my pops.

He will take care of it. He's getting closer on his 356 restoration. That car is coming out nice!

Biostar01 > PetarVN, GLI Guy, now with stupid power 12/29/2013 at 13:56

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Used C30 is my choice.

Volvo nut FTW.

Erm, if you're looking for one, Cargurus.com is a really useful place cause they seem to have all the cheap-car listings in your area for good carmakers.

JohnPlayerSpecial > Klaus Schmoll 12/29/2013 at 19:03

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What is that? It looks very handsome...we don't have that in the US :/

Klaus Schmoll > JohnPlayerSpecial 12/30/2013 at 07:35

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Skoda Octavia RS. Basically a Golf GTI underneath. Same engine and chassis. Just a bit more practical and a bit cheaper, too.

BlasterBob > whoarder is tellurium 01/06/2014 at 01:46

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I spent some time shopping for these, until research on the appropriate forums started to indicate that the reason there are so many available with 50k miles on the clock is that's about when the LS2 starts breaking everything else in the puny Commodore chassis.

vr6geek > PetarVN, GLI Guy, now with stupid power 01/10/2014 at 23:42

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-BMW M Coupe, although it'd probably have to be an S52 for less than $20,000. A good S54 is just too much.

-Acura Integra Type R, because rare and awesome.

-Mk4 Volkswagen Golf R32. Not the best AWD hatch out there, but I love them.

-Because I've really started to appreciate the aesthetics of Subaru's older vehicles but don't want to be a WRX guy, Subaru Forester. I really like the look of the 2001-2002 model years, I could use it as a dog transport, and it can be had with a manual.

-Lastly, let's talk newer cars that can be had for less than $20,000 slightly used. Fiat 500 Abarth, Ford Fiesta ST, Mk6 GTI, Subaru BRZ. Yeah yeah, the BRZ is still a tad too pricey, but talk to me in 6 months. I found one on Autotrader for $21,000, so it won't be long until we start seeing sub-$20k examples.

Poorsha > PetarVN, GLI Guy, now with stupid power 01/11/2014 at 00:30

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I agree with most of those options, but I would like to ad a Mazda FD Rx-7 (clean, low-miles, and well taken car of) to the list. Definitely doesn't have the practicality of the GTI, but it feels more like a sports car, if that's what you're after.

Poorsha > Poorsha 01/11/2014 at 03:42

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20k is also the bottom range of an Acura (Honda) NSX

153624 - Straight Six > Klaus Schmoll 01/11/2014 at 13:39

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Looks way better. My father just bought a GTI. Great car, but the shifter on it is atrocious . I can't imaging how anyone looked at it and thought "Yes, this is an excellent shifter for a sporty car. Our buyers love literally rowing a boat. "

Mike > PetarVN, GLI Guy, now with stupid power 01/11/2014 at 14:09

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Civic Si Coupe

Ticks all boxes (used 2012-ish), fun as hell to drive (my EX-L already puts a smile on my face, and it's a bloody FWD slushbox), and it's a Honda, so it will outlast modern civilization.